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River Philip, The Unfair Fishery

river philip regulations lure

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Poll: River Philip, The unfair fishery (61 member(s) have cast votes)

Who thinks it's fair that fly fisherman get to have free reign over river philip while lure / bait fisherman have to suffer?

  1. Not me, I only lure / bait fish (6 votes [9.84%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.84%

  2. Not me, I prefer lure / bait fishing but will fly fish if it's the only option (10 votes [16.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 16.39%

  3. Me (45 votes [73.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 73.77%

Vote

#21 RyanLandry

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Posted 29 March 2013 - 07:25 PM

Its not all that bad for them Ryan, they get to hit the River Philip May 15th with what ever method they choose to use . This river is the second best producing salmon river in Nova Scotia and 99% of these guys want to use bell weights and allow the fish to swallow the hook before they set it in fear that they might miss the hook set . There are guys up there that spend countless hours restoring and working on the river all seasons long . There is a reason that these fish are big because this river has been set out for a trout management area . When these regulations first come in when the fish were not as plentiful ,you never hear anything from the fish killers . But once it is restored and the management is working you get guys that just dont think its fair that they cant go and kill . But these regs are put in to help the salmon as they are trying to fill their guts with smelt for restoring their bodys. They shut down West river in Pictiu to the 15th of May for all angling ,and the conservation minded people are pleased with this decision , but once the trout get big in the West you will hear guys complain cause they cant go get em . Besides ,all north shore rivers have 20"+ trout in them .....you just have to go fishing .

that's good to hear! I just hope that I'll be able to make use of my centrepins when I move back home! god knows ill have no issues using the fly rods. not to hijack the thread but are there any rivers where I would be allowed to centrepin fish for salmon? or is it fly fishing only province wide?
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#22 Terran

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 06:25 AM

that's good to hear! I just hope that I'll be able to make use of my centrepins when I move back home! god knows ill have no issues using the fly rods. not to hijack the thread but are there any rivers where I would be allowed to centrepin fish for salmon? or is it fly fishing only province wide?


RyanLandry,

Don't worry about using your centrepins when you get home. They sound like they may be something you should try for Striped Bass.

Unless you can fish the centrepins with an artificial fly; the salmon are going to be a fly fishing thing. But, damn...you might have just the rig for Striper fishing.

I'd give it a try.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#23 RyanLandry

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 07:12 AM

RyanLandry,

Don't worry about using your centrepins when you get home. They sound like they may be something you should try for Striped Bass.

Unless you can fish the centrepins with an artificial fly; the salmon are going to be a fly fishing thing. But, damn...you might have just the rig for Striper fishing.

I'd give it a try.

Terran

I was thinking the exact same thing regarding the stripers! And yes we drift artificial flys all the time, black or olive stones are my go to. Wooly buggers work good as well.
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#24 Terran

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 07:45 AM

I was thinking the exact same thing regarding the stripers! And yes we drift artificial flys all the time, black or olive stones are my go to. Wooly buggers work good as well.


From the 2012 Salmon Regulations:

SALMON FISHING IS ONLY PERMITTED USING ARTIFICIAL FLIES.

WHEN FISHING FOR SALMON IN SALMON FISHING AREA 18 ( NORTHUMBERLAND STRAIT RIVERS ) ONLY BARBLESS OR PINCHED BARB ARTIFICIAL FLIES ARE PERMITTED FROM OCTOBER 1 TO OCTOBER 31 INCLUSIVE. BARBED ARTIFICIAL FLIES ARE PERMITTED BEFORE OCTOBER 1. IN ALL OTHER SALMON FISHING AREAS, ONLY BARBLESS OR PINCHED BARB ARTIFICIAL FLIES MAY BE USED WHEN FISHING FOR SALMON.


Here is a link: http://www.gov.ns.ca...onregs2012-.pdf

If you can work it within the Regulations, I can't see an issue. (Others may have a voice on this)

As for the Stripers, I think you'll be spending alot of time perfecting your centrepin Striper techniques. Might be your new fave!

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#25 RyanLandry

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:04 AM

That's good news! Thanks for the info. I was also thinking shad on the centrepin may be fun as well. I'm going to build a lighter action shorter rod for trout and shad, 13' may be a little long for the small creeks and rivers.
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#26 Terran

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:12 AM

That's good news! Thanks for the info. I was also thinking shad on the centrepin may be fun as well. I'm going to build a lighter action shorter rod for trout and shad, 13' may be a little long for the small creeks and rivers.


Not sure? Where you're palming the reel, you might want the extra length: for Shad anyway. You could certainly get away with a 13' in the Shubie and Stewiacke Rivers. Especially if you're wading with it. The only issues would arise when you are fishing from shore in areas where overhead and behind you might be obstructed with brush, limbs, etc.

For trout: it might be overkill. Although there are places where fishing Brown trout it might come in handy.

Sounds like you have a whole new learning curve to explore. Have fun.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#27 RyanLandry

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:32 AM

The length doesn't concern me as much as the action. The 13' rods with a 5" centrepin work best on fish around 4lbs and up. So I'm thinking maybe a 10' rod with a 4 1/4" pin for 1 - 5 lb fish. I can't wait to move back home!
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#28 Terran

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:33 AM

RyanLandry,

Here is a link to the Maritime Provinces Fishery Regulations: http://laws-lois.jus...-55/page-1.html

This is the Act that the Sportfishing Regulations are taken from. It is not a bad idea to familiarize yourself with this document. It's quite informative.

DFO puts out Variation Orders when issues arise that require adjustment to the Regulations (i.e.: river closures, special management directives, etc.) . It's always a good idea to check those as well.

Thought it might be helpful.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#29 Terran

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 08:36 AM

The length doesn't concern me as much as the action. The 13' rods with a 5" centrepin work best on fish around 4lbs and up. So I'm thinking maybe a 10' rod with a 4 1/4" pin for 1 - 5 lb fish. I can't wait to move back home!


You can get some pretty big Shad. I've caught them over 5 lbs. Not to mention they certainly account for themselves as if they were a larger fish.

But, I'll leave that up to you. Have fun.

T
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#30 camel

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Posted 30 March 2013 - 02:26 PM

Snoop,seeing as you only made one complaint and never replied to anyone that replies to youy post,this is just for you.Why not complain about the southampton river?Can't fish there till may 15.By the time River Phillip opens up,May 15, the salmon will be gone and you'll have free reign on the trout.The best part of the river is open April 1st for your 20+ inch browns.The upper river will out fish the lower river any day of the week for the big browns.You just gotta knnow where to go.

As for there being no other rivers to catch your 20+ inch trout I'm guessin you don't get around to much.Wallace river produces more trout than the River Phillip with quite a few 20+inchers.Then theres the Waugh River which has some great brown trout.Southampton River(when it opens) has some fantastic brown trout and great sea trout runs.


I've talked to quite a few fellas about the regs on the River Phillip and some don't like them some do.The ones that don't,they go fish another river till the Phillip is open.The ones that really complain also state that they love hookin salmon on a lure in the spring.Which is what I think most are gripping about.

I think it's great what they,ve done on the Phillip,both regs and river work.In a few more years that river is gonna be dynomite for troutin anytime of the season on every part of the river.Hopfully it'll become the number one salmon river in the province,which in my opinion isn't that far off right now.
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#31 Jay

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 01:43 PM

this is all well and good but what is the reasoning for only River Philip and I think Maccan rivers being off limits until May are there not Salmon in the Wallace river in equal numbers ? Just a thought but where is the standard coming from ? I just think it is an unfare restriction placed on trout fishers because salmon fishers have deeper pockets and fatter wallets . There are so many salmon in the River Philip now I dont know how the trout survive .
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#32 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 02:00 PM

I am unsure if the other rivers in that general area were lobbied for as heavily.. I know that a great deal of effort and work has gone into river work on the rivers in question.. how many bait fishermen were included in those that did the work? This is not an accusation of any kind just an honest question.. when the decisions were made to suggest specific rivers to the advisory board the same voices could have easily included other rivers or other criteria that would see a conservational mentality behind the movement... now that you are aware that things can be changed, bait fishermen and fly anglers alike can show up at the advisory council meetings and let your voice be heard as to what season, gear, river restrictions you would like to see implemented or increased or lengthened etc etc... I support this change as I would for any river that holds salmon.. I would also support any claim for complete change to C&R on any river that has or had a run of salmon (just in the off chance that any decided to return home)
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#33 Terran

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 06:23 PM

Just curious, but would the non-fly fishers accept a list of gear restrictions that might improve the chances of successful release of salmon?

If you could fish lures with only single barbless hook (no trebles)? Bait fish with barbless circle hook only? No bait whatsoever? Catch and release only on these rivers?

Would this be of interest?

I guess what I'm getting at is this; exactly what are you looking for? This is about protecting the resource and hopefully nurturing what's left of the wild Atlantic Salmon in Nova Scotia.

I haven't fished these rivers in a number of years, but it sounds as if whatever is being done to improve and protect the resource is working.

I fly fish, but I also spin fish. So I guess that makes me the bastard in all of this? Yes, I enjoy fly fishing...no, that doesn't make me some stuck up snob...and I certainly don't have deeper pockets or a fatter wallet. Nor do a lot of my friends who enjoy fly fishing.

Yeah, there are a few pompous a$$holes who think fly fishing makes them special, but you'll find that in anything. Most of the anglers I meet fly fishing are just normal folks. Even the Doctors and lawyers I've met didn't put on aires. So what is it with this perception of fly fishing and fly fishermen being anything but anglers out enjoying the sport by their preferred method?

I'm the same guy when I'm out spin fishing as I am when I'm out fly fishing. Try talking to me and we'll probably get on great. Approach me as if I'm unwanted or some stuck up prick and we're probably not going to get on too well.

Instead of the "us against them" attitude. Maybe try figuring out a way to work this out that meets everyones interests.

Or hell, just take up fly fishing. You'd probably enjoy it.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#34 BrownTrout Stalker

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 06:36 PM

Good one Terran..
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#35 trout snout

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 07:16 PM

good post terran
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#36 Gregory

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 07:37 PM

Agreed, good post Terran
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#37 basindawg

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 07:44 PM

Good one Terran, knocked er outta the park that time !
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#38 Troutin on the Fly

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 09:33 PM

this is all well and good but what is the reasoning for only River Philip and I think Maccan rivers being off limits until May are there not Salmon in the Wallace river in equal numbers ? Just a thought but where is the standard coming from ? I just think it is an unfare restriction placed on trout fishers because salmon fishers have deeper pockets and fatter wallets . There are so many salmon in the River Philip now I dont know how the trout survive .


Fly fisherman have done a hell of a job doing restoration on River P. They are probably responsible for it being the best north shore river in NS. Not to say no bait fisherman helped out but we all know the work Danny has done.

If it was opened up to bait/spin fisherman we would see alot of salmon deaths and alot of traffic going to the river to specifically target salmon. That's not to say some fisherman aren't out to just catch trout and follow the rules but it only takes a few to make an impact. Fly Fishing generally alows less damage to the fish.

Also if you read the regs I think Southhampton is open above the forks by the bridge and opens up below that later in the season. Could be wrong though.
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#39 girlfisher

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Posted 01 April 2013 - 01:23 PM

Good post Terran a point for you
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please practice a sustainable harvest

#40 camel

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Posted 01 April 2013 - 01:32 PM

this is all well and good but what is the reasoning for only River Philip and I think Maccan rivers being off limits until May are there not Salmon in the Wallace river in equal numbers ? Just a thought but where is the standard coming from ? I just think it is an unfare restriction placed on trout fishers because salmon fishers have deeper pockets and fatter wallets . There are so many salmon in the River Philip now I dont know how the trout survive .



I'm not the type to sugar coat things and those two statements are,well pathetic.I live pay check to pay check and also fly fish.Fished the Phillip for 30 years now since my dad took me as a boy.Fished every type of way you can,bait,lures and fly.In the spring 100% of fishermen say they are there for the trout but can't wait to hook a salmon.Seen good years and bad years on the river.I've seen a good number of salmon mishandled by trout fishermen over the years.Pliers shoved as deep as they can be just to get at that .05 cent hokk that was loaded with worm and swallowed by a salmon.Salmon laid and drug through the mud and rocks,dropped and then released only to go belly up and die.

What difference does it make to the trout fishermen to have to wait a month till the salmon disperse out to the ocean????

The trout will still be there and you might also still get to hook some salmon in May.

Fish another river or lake till May and you'll catch trout.

So I guess all the hard work that went into the Phillip was just done for rich selfish fly fishermen to catch all the trout in the river in the spring???????

Fat chance,it was done to enhance the river,fish habitat,insect life,spawning ground for trout and salmon to ensure the river and its fish last for the next generation to catch trout as well as salmon.Great work to danny and the river enhancement workers that helped.There are ALOT of fishermen that appreciate the work you do.Thank You/
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