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Aquaculture Ass. Fights Back On New Website - Guess We're Getting Their Attention


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#21 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 09:48 AM

Terran my belief, which is shared by others, is that what is happening on the West Coast has been happening here all along at the same time without much comment. The introduction of sea cages into our waters on this Coast over the last few decades has increased steadily while the numbers of wild salmon returning have been declining steadily... coincidence I think not. I have emailed Alexandra Morton a few times and discussed a couple issues that I am concerned about. She has tried for a number of years apparently to get people to collect samples on the East Coast in order to establish in hard evidence what we all assume, and that is the transmission of contaminants and disease from caged fish to the natives swimming by.

I have begun compilling a list of groups and associations in both NB and NS that would or should be concerned with this data as it affects what they are fighting for.. I will begin contacting them once I complete my list of groups and contacts for those groups. (for this list I will need some help from members to speed up the process, you can either post them here or PM the group name with a contact email address). I need to contact these groups to see if they are interested in funding some of the work that will be required. As Alexandra has mentioned in the video each test is ~$200 which if it results in information either way positive for disease or infection of a strain associated with the sea cage sites, or negative meaning the fish population in that area are clean and healthy, then I would think that these Associations would be willing to produce this small amount of funding to secure this information. If negatives are recieved then it can also work at establishing a baseline of a period of no infection.

We as anglers need to get involved and this is a small part to play. I am also contacting Dr. Kibenge at UPEI to establish communications with his lab so that when we are able to we will have the avenue to get these samples tested. Since anglers are out fishing anyway, who better to collect samples or make note of what is going on in the rivers. If they see dead / dying or diseased fish then retain it, take a sample and get it sent off to the lab. By me contacting the various groups and associations around the maritime provinces we will have the means for anglers in those areas to contact these groups to ensure that the samples get delivered and tests paid for.

I have concern for many reasons because of my educational background being in Aquaculture, I understand what is going on and it is one of the reasons why I never followed my education into a career. I have pushed for land based ever since I have graduated. One of my concerns, which I will do some further research on, is what is the time required for fish to get the ISA virus and then become sick and die? Can it happen over winter? I am concerned that many locations record salmon coming into the rivers to get return numbers but I am unsure of them doing counts on fish exiting the rivers either during the season or in the spring at ice out. If fish come into the rivers and have passed by an infected sea cage site, they effectively carry the infection into the river. These fish spawn and then many remain in the rivers for the winter months. Because the pools that these fish are being held in are small and it is possible to concentrate fish in these locations, basically creating a worse environment then experienced in the sea cages. We all know what happens out there when one gets sick, it spreads quickly because they are in such close proximity. Multiply that because of the freshwater environment and then the ice flows keeping fish in, compacting them in many cases. So my concern is if there is winter kill(and I am not so sure that there is, just asking the question), is it just left as winter kill or are tests done to verify that they did not indeed die because of illness.

Basically if people are out and they see something out of the ordinary then it can be sampled, if they are retaining some fish to eat it can be sampled etc...
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#22 Terran

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 10:20 AM

Exstream,

I agree with your opening statement wholeheartedly. In fact, the decline of Atlantic Salmon on the East Coast could also be directly related, in part, to the West Coast feedlot proliferations, in a way. The Salmon Enhancement Program and Government hatcheries were effected early on as DFO began turning from their mandate to protect, to a more "commercial" interest - aquaculture.

In fact, eggs from hatcheries, meant to grow wild salmon replacements were "misdirected" to fish farms early on (80's).

I applaud your efforts. I have been, in my own small way, trying to educate and inform as many people as possible to the ramifications of this industry. I have certainly garnered quite an education on the topic. I would offer any help, that I could provide within my means, to assist in your "project". Please feel free to PM me at any time.

It is gratifying to see people take an interest and take some action.

"To do nothing is unacceptable"

Respectfully,

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#23 rpen

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 12:58 PM

Just sent the Aq Ass's this

http://www.theglobea...article9563287/

Another nail in their coffin!
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#24 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 01:16 PM

I just read that on another site and I think it is fantastic news.. here's hoping that is actually going to take place... I am thrilled and excited that DFO is actually going to let this woman do what she does best. First that they let her speak out and now to actually document and track the various pathogens... now all we can pray for is that the same process be adopted here on the East Coast.
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#25 Duckerdan

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 01:25 PM

eye opener..
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#26 Duckerdan

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 01:34 PM

and now all my facebook friends will see. and all theirs and all their and all theirs ect ect ect. FB do have some good points other then telling people when you goto the can.....lol
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#27 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 02:50 PM

One more reason why I don't have facbook.. lol.. I can't imagine that I would ever need to know when any of my friends went to the can..
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#28 pmorris

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 02:53 PM

One more reason why I don't have facbook.. lol.. I can't imagine that I would ever need to know when any of my friends went to the can..


I prefer more subtle references to my bodily functions. For example, I just gave birth to a rather large Cooke Aquaculture executive.
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I started reading a book about anti-gravity and I just couldn't put it down.


#29 Terran

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 08:57 PM

I prefer more subtle references to my bodily functions. For example, I just gave birth to a rather large Cooke Aquaculture executive.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

Dropped a salmon off at the feedlot, eh? Cooke'd one off?

Love it!

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#30 Terran

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Posted 09 March 2013 - 09:22 PM

Just sent the Aq Ass's this

http://www.theglobea...article9563287/

Another nail in their coffin!


Rpen,

Great link my friend. Now this is the kind of "feel good" story that keeps a fella going.

Having watched the nearly "constipated" look on Kristi Miller's face, during the Cohen Inquiry, I'm not surprised that she needed the opportunity to get some of her science out. Harper's gag order nearly had her blood pressure popping her eye's out.

Now, as for Ottawa and/or DFO allowing her to speak - interesting. Perhaps they had the opportunity to watch "Salmon Confidential" and saw how bloody guilty the whole "Government Gang" looked at the Cohen Inquiry? As I said before, they looked like a bunch of Goodfella's at a mob trial. I have never seen so many "tell's" and body language stresses in one room.

Hopefully, this is the beginning of a high light in the rather dark, recent history, of DFO; not a publicity spin that never see's the light of day.

And speaking of the Cohen Inquiry, I wonder if the Justice's recommendations may have played some part in this. God knows, DFO took a serious shagging in those. Would be nice to think that something came out of the tax dollars spent.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#31 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 10:44 AM

The person with the most signs of "Tells" as you say... was the CFIA director.. that woman blinked more times than I could count..lol.. Everytime she said, there is no disease present she blinked a little more..
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#32 Terran

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 10:55 AM

The person with the most signs of "Tells" as you say... was the CFIA director.. that woman blinked more times than I could count..lol.. Everytime she said, there is no disease present she blinked a little more..


Exstream,

Yeah, her body language or "tells" were pretty amusing. See the look on her face? She looked like she'd just gotten through eating an ISA infected Cooke Salmon. :D Man was she blinking.

Did you happen to notice the blotches of redness in alot of their faces? They all should have been on blood pressure monitors.

Check out the look on Stephen Stephens face. If looks could kill.

If you turn off the volume and just watch the "tells" it's pretty obvious who was "fibbin".

Kristi Miller, every time she was asked a question, looked like she was about to cry. Must have been horrible being under oathe, trying to answer questions honestly, yet having your employer (the Government and DFO) scrutinizing your every word. All the while knowing your job is probably in the balance based on how you respond. Freakin cruel situation.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#33 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 11:53 AM

She was a trooper for sure and when she named Stephen Stephens it could have been in a mastercard commercial cause it was priceless..lol
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#34 Terran

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 12:19 PM

Exstream,

Speaking of Stephen Stephens, I wonder if you have seen this particular email between him and the CFIA regarding a new ISAv found at AquaBounty in Fortune, PEI?

Stephen Stephens Email to CFIA

The email is dated 2009 and they are referring to the same AquaBounty that is Genetically Modifying the Frankenfish. Not only that but this was before DFO ever acknowledge ISA on the East Coast.

When I came across this letter, I was stunned. To say the least. Yet not surprised.

Thought you might find it interesting. I had posted the link before, in another thread, but you may have missed it.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#35 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 12:43 PM

This email was released and made part of the Cohen report wasn't it? It is frustrating that so many things have occured across the Country to point the finger of negligence at the Government at various levels... DFO, CFIA should all be ashamed of what they have let happen in our waters on both Coasts.

Here they let known infected fish remain in the waters which have native species swimming by and risk the chance of getting infected..
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#36 Terran

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 01:08 PM

This email was released and made part of the Cohen report wasn't it? It is frustrating that so many things have occured across the Country to point the finger of negligence at the Government at various levels... DFO, CFIA should all be ashamed of what they have let happen in our waters on both Coasts.

Here they let known infected fish remain in the waters which have native species swimming by and risk the chance of getting infected..


Exstream,

Yes it was one of the many exhibits at the Inquiry. I remember when I first read it that I was taken aback by the date and location of the infection. Not to mention the reference to a "new" strain of ISAv.

Not only does AquaBounty have the GM salmon up for approval, but I believe they are a supplier of hatchery stock as well. (I may be wrong as I can't find the article I'm refering too at the moment).

Two years ago, I had a discussion with a DFO biologist regarding the ISA outbreak on the West Coast and my concerns regarding the then newly opening sites here, in the East. This was well before the first announced outbreak at Cooke.

I recall his assurance that due to "rigid inspections and regulations" this could never happen here. He was soooo sure.

Now here we are and I find myself wondering...was he really that naive? Did he really believe what he said? OR... Was I just being fed the "Company Line"?

With the Budget Cuts, scientists being gagged and poor inspection record, what chance is there that anything will be caught, before it has become a major issue?

My question, is it negligence or is it perhaps something a little more sinister? A plan in the works?

As you mention though, it is our wild species that are truly paying the price, regardless of the reason.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#37 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 01:20 PM

The virus that we have on the East Coast is a different strain of the ISAv. So is this unique to the east coast and some sort of mutation of the European strain or just a different strain altogether. Mutations scare me if this is the case and would be reason enough to maliciously attack all the sea cage sites. Those infected fish and the sites need to be removed.. not when they are a harvestable size but right now. We need to get these operations on land. Instead of the Government pouring money into this open pit I would much rather pay more to have them preserve something. Get them onland, pay the extra costs, save our environment and native species. Be responsible and prove that you can lead a country.
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#38 Terran

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 01:45 PM

Exstream,

I've been "preaching" the same thing for years. If you go back and look at the topics and posts I've made on this site (alone) over the last couple years, you'll see were on the same page.

You'd also find that I'm no fan of our Governments and how they are mis-spending our tax dollars.

Closed containment is the only answer. A proven, better quality, product with "none" of the environmental impact, disease or parasites; who wouldn't pay a little more?

What could have been accomplished in research and development of the closed containment system with the dollars that the Dexter Government shovelled to Cooke? Yet alone what the Fed's have spent, through DFO promoting the open feedlot industry and defending the many "issues" that have arisen.

The other thing I wonder, wouldn't closed containment sites generate more tax dollars? (Property taxes, etc.) Are the open pen sites taxed for occupying the space on our coastline? Not that I've ever heard. Yet structures on land would certainly require property tax being paid.

Then take into consideration the spin off jobs created during the construction of closed containment sites. Possible monies generated for renewable energy equipment manufacturers for things like wind turbines. Land clearing, pipe fitting, etc.

Then there's the high nitrogen waste that could collected to be sold as fertilizer.

Again, it would seem that the closed containment concept would certainly promise a far better return on investment. But instead the government sticks to the, Norwegian, open feedlot use it, abuse it and move on model.

Enjoy discussing the matter with you.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 


#39 Exstreamfisherman

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 02:09 PM

I agree Terran, land based aquaculture sites would be far superior in almost every aspect to both the grower and the consumer. Except in price of course. You are correct as well about the spin off for increased jobs etc. Both in the actual construction of the facilities as well as maintaining them and running the d ay to day operations. Expansion of these land based sites are only limited by the amount of water you can supply to them. If you are next to the shore then pumping stations pulling sea water into the facility will be one of your largest expenses to get set up. It has to pull water from far enough out that it is not subject to as much of the variations common in shallow water. Siltation, sediment, debris, temperature etc.. all of these things can be removed but if you are able to secure a good clean source then you are better off for it. Once the water is in the facility it then gets, cleaned of debris and any other precipitate. Bacteria can also be removed by using UV and other methods to break down any unwanted issues. The last process is to run the water through a chilling process to bring it to an optimum temperature for growth and food conversion.

Re-circulation of the water is best to reduce costs obviously, this re-used water gets to go through drum filters and bio-filters (usually a fluidized bed of sand or plastic beads), the effluent can then be captured and used as you suggested as one of the best fertilizers on the market.

Money well spent in my opinion.. the only thing keeping me from doing it is money..
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#40 Terran

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 10:29 AM

Here is an update on the fish kill at the Snow Island Salmon Inc. site on the Eastern Shore.

I have found a follow up story, from the CBC, dated March 8, 2013. Take a look:

'Significant' fish kill not result of disease: fish vet
Paul Withers CBC News Posted: Mar 8, 2013 7:03 PM AT Last Updated: Mar 8, 2013 9:24 PM AT

N.S. chief fish veterinarian says cold weather, storms likely caused fish deaths

An infectious fish disease is not to blame for a "significant" fish kill last month at a salmon farm on Nova Scotia's Eastern Shore, according to the province's chief fish veterinarian.

"We did not find any reportable disease at the site," said Dr. Roland Cusack.

Nova Scotia's Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture tested 30 dead salmon taken Feb. 28 from six pens at the Snow Island Salmon Inc. operation at Owl's Head, N.S.

The department released the results on Friday.

"We look for everything. In this case infectious salmon anaemia is the reportable disease we were looking for, we did not find that," said Cusack.

In 2012, ISA outbreaks led to the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of salmon at fish farms owned by Cooke Aquaculture in southwest Nova Scotia.

Infectious Salmon Anemia (ISA) is a highly contagious and deadly to fish but harmless to humans.

Cusack said cold water and stormy weather in February are the likely cause of the fish kill last month.

The company blamed the weather from the start.

"We're pleased with the results although they are not surprising." said Robert Taylor of Snow Island Salmon, a subsidiary of Scotland’s Loch Duart Ltd.

The Owl's Head site has 24 pens, each containing between 15,000 and 17,000 fish.

The company has not said how many salmon perished. Some fish did survive.

Dead fish are being trucked away to rendering plant.

Taylor said this fish kill will not deter Snow Island from opening two more fish farms in the area.

"We are committed to developing salmon farming on the Eastern Shore and to keeping our employees," he said.

Opponents of the company's expansion, like Bill Williams of Sheet Harbour, say this fish kill shows the Eastern Shore's shallow bays make the area ill-suited to salmon farming.

"If those two bays had been stocked with fish there would have been three bays of dead fish to clean up rather than one," Williams told CBC News.

Snow Island is still removing dead fish from its pens.

The company said it will release more details — including the number of fish killed — after its insurance company completes its investigation.

An infectious fish disease is not to blame for a "significant" fish kill last month at a salmon farm on Nova Scotia's Eastern Shore, according to the province's chief fish veterinarian.

"We did not find any reportable disease at the site," said Dr. Roland Cusack.

Nova Scotia's Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture tested 30 dead salmon taken Feb. 28 from six pens at the Snow Island Salmon Inc. operation at Owl's Head, N.S.

The department released the results on Friday.

"We look for everything. In this case infectious salmon anaemia is the reportable disease we were looking for, we did not find that," said Cusack.

In 2012, ISA outbreaks led to the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of salmon at fish farms owned by Cooke Aquaculture in southwest Nova Scotia.

Infectious Salmon Anemia (ISA) is a highly contagious and deadly to fish but harmless to humans.

Cusack said cold water and stormy weather in February are the likely cause of the fish kill last month.

The company blamed the weather from the start.

"We're pleased with the results although they are not surprising." said Robert Taylor of Snow Island Salmon, a subsidiary of Scotland’s Loch Duart Ltd.

The Owl's Head site has 24 pens, each containing between 15,000 and 17,000 fish.

The company has not said how many salmon perished. Some fish did survive.

Dead fish are being trucked away to rendering plant.

Taylor said this fish kill will not deter Snow Island from opening two more fish farms in the area.

"We are committed to developing salmon farming on the Eastern Shore and to keeping our employees," he said.

Opponents of the company's expansion, like Bill Williams of Sheet Harbour, say this fish kill shows the Eastern Shore's shallow bays make the area ill-suited to salmon farming.

"If those two bays had been stocked with fish there would have been three bays of dead fish to clean up rather than one," Williams told CBC News.

Snow Island is still removing dead fish from its pens.

The company said it will release more details — including the number of fish killed — after its insurance company completes its investigation.
(http://www.cbc.ca/ne...ll-weather.html)


Despite the articles headline it may be more interesting to take a close look at exactly what has been stated by the Department of Fisheries and Aquaculture's - Dr. Robert Cusack.

The first statement that I find intersting would be:

"We did not find any reportable disease at the site," said Dr. Roland Cusack.

Note the term: Reportable Disease

The article goes on to further state:

"We look for everything. In this case infectious salmon anaemia is the reportable disease we were looking for, we did not find that," said Cusack.

So, there is a major fish kill at an aquaculture site, in the Province, and the Dept. of Fisheries and Aquaculture send their head fish Vet to investigate. They take 30 fish and test for one reportable disease and then make the (giant leap) statement:

An infectious fish disease is not to blame for a "significant" fish kill last month at a salmon farm on Nova Scotia's Eastern Shore, according to the province's chief fish veterinarian.

Holy Crap! Of the myriad of infectious diseases that have been found at aquaculture sites in Canada, and elsewhere; the Province's chief fish veterinarian only tests for ONE reportable disease (ISAv) and then makes the blanket statement that, "An infectious disease is not to blame".


I wonder, did he check for , perhaps, Piscine Reovirus, Salmon Leukemia, Salmon Alphavirus or any of the long list of diseases found in other fish farms?

Is he aware of Loch Duart's record in Scotland? Loch Duart - the parent company of this aquaculture site.

Take a look at this site for info on diseases at other aquaculture sites that they didn't test for: http://www.farmedsal...stics_2008.html

It is absolutely amazing that this kind of blanket statement has been fed to the media based on what they actually state is the testing for ONE disease. If they tested for others why not just state that. Technically, they have told the truth. They tested for one reportable virus (ISA) and didn't find it. Can they say there is NO disease involved at this site? Not in my opinion.

Terran
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"In these sad and ominous days of mad fortune chasing, every patriotic, thoughtful citizen, whether he fishes or not, should lament that we have not among our countrymen more fishermen."  Grover Cleveland
 





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